Mark Applegate, September 1st, 2024
Title
Mark Applegate, September 1st, 2024
Description
In this interview, Mark Applegate shares how the Polio vaccine was received very differently from the Covid-19 vaccine and how it has become political to have an opinion about Covid-19.
Publisher
Detroit Historical Society
Date
9/1/24
Rights
Detroit Historical Society
Language
en-US
Narrator/Interviewee's Name
Mark Applegate
Brief Biography
Mark Applegate is a retired engineer and lifelong Detroiter who has seen the city through polio up until Covid.
Interviewer's Name
Kevin Hawthorne
Interview Length
11:33
Transcription
Kevin Hawthorne: Hello, this is Kevin Hawthorne with the Detroit Historical Society for the oral history on Covid 19. I'm joined here with today. You please introduce yourself.
Mark Applegate: Yeah. My name is Mark Applegate.
KH: Could you please file your name for the record?
MA: Mark M a r k Applegate. A p p l e g a t e
KH: And, what area do you live in? In the metro Detroit area?
MA: We live in Southfield.
KH: And how long have lived there?
MA: Yeah, about ten years.
KH: And before that, what other areas have you lived in?
MA: Well, I grew up in Detroit. Lived also in Huntington Woods. So I go to the Kalamazoo. Other places too
KH: And, what is your, line of work?
MA: I was, wide area network engineer and I'm retired
KH: And how long did you have that position?
MA: Say about 20 years.
KH: And when did you retire?
MA: 2012.
KH: So, with Covid 19, when were you first aware of the disease?
MA: I think probably pretty soon after it started, I saw news reports about. That A disease that was sweeping through. Europe then, you know, and. So I think, you know Other skiers, at Ski resorts in Austria say for some of the first things I hear about first and then eventually, once it's going into the United States.
KH: And when you first heard about it, were you concerned or would you think like, because I've talked to some people who we live through something like, the Ebola outbreak a couple years ago or swine flu when we were all growing up. And those are things that people were worried about and that ended up not being as serious. Where are you of that mind that it would just be a temporary thing, or were you more worried that it would be more serious?
MA: I was I was concerned about it because, for two reasons. I mean. Essentially I remember yeah, I remember reading about the flu and after World War one, 1918 that, you know, killed. Millions of people across the world. There was potential of something like that occurring. And I also saw I was concerned because well, our government seemed to be totally Incompetent, totally unaware of how to deal with patients individually the President continually lied about about what was going on and what he was doing about it. And essentially, you know, my feeling was. They weren't going to do anything about it.
KH: So you felt like, left by the wayside a little bit.
MA: Well, not left by the wayside. I think I think essentially, I think there were people who were working really hard to save people. To help people to, you know help people that got sick in the United States, you know. People, health care workers were, you know, really killing themselves trying to save everybody they could. the people that were sick in hospitals. And I remember, you know stories about about you know piles of bodies and you know— You know that they will hold in in temporary storage and, you know, it's just and people, you know, health care workers will work and, you know. 70, 80, 90 hours a week. And having them, you know put on all kinds of protective gear. You know, just concerned about what was happening. I think our health system had had some ideas about what to do with it and try and resolve it but it really seemed to the, the leadership of. The government and President Trump was just a disaster. You know, a million people have died. That's, you know. The amount that the people, a million people died who could have lived if we had a reasonable response
KH: And with your experience with Covid, did you contract disease in the past four years?
MA: Yeah, we ended up getting it. I ended up catching, in Germany visiting our and daughter.
KH: And how was your experience with the disease?
MA: Well, I had I think by that point I had, like 4 vaccinations and boosters and It wasn't pleasant. But, you know, I survived it and you know felt bad for a number of days took about two weeks for It to clear out
KH: And then what was your experience with the Covid 19 lockdown?
MA: At that point I was I was retired. So I didn't have to go and I didn't have to go into work and I was, you know working remotely anyway. So, you know.. I think the main, the main problem was the concern about, you know when we had to go out and purchase food you know the main thing was, you know, making sure that we had a mask available to wear. Also, you know, just the whole craziness of people.. of it becoming a political issue, wearing. A mask, becoming a Political issue, and having people you know, harass, you're a threat in here because you had a mask on just seemed ridiculous, you know, to me and say, as it was. It went from being, a health issue to a political issue and a crazy response. Well, you know, to a segment of population.
KH: Did you personally ever get, like, harassed for wearing a mask on public?
MA: Yeah, a number of. Times, yeah. Sort of people made comments or. You know. They acted in a threatening manner or, you know, whatever. Yeah It was it was kind of ridiculous.
KH: And during lockdown, was there anything in particular you tried to do to keep your, your, your mind off what was happening?
MA: See, I don't remember doing anything different. No, I mean, you know, I mean, yeah, we tried. There was a kind of a crazy time, but you just tried to, you know Make sense of things and and, you know, get on with life. So that's all I can remember.
KH: All right. Is there anything on the topic of Covid that we haven't discussed that you'd like to, speak on?
MA: No, I think I think. That's pretty much it. I mean, you know, we've I did, you know, we did travel in Germany while. Well, you know, there were. Covid restrictions, some not so much in lockdown. I thought people there were really pretty sensible. You know, and mass transit trains. And so because of some people, people wore masks and there was a, you know, no bullshit about it. It was just as something you did, everybody did it.
KH: So you so you saw there's like a marked difference of like the response in the Detroit area versus like abroad?
MA: Yeah, for sure. At least in the Detroit area. And, you know, just go. Out, you know, we went hiking sometimes out in Kensington or whatever. And then. You you'd meet people out there who were pointedly not wearing masks and, you know. Or, you know, kind of would make comments about, you know, why are you wearing that here? What's going on? What's wrong with you that kind of stuff
KH: What about, when you would, during the Covid 19, when you would go out into the the city of Detroit was a different than going to someplace like Kensington or did it didn't feel about the same.
MA: Right. No, I never I had a. I think during, you know, during the time that. Covid was was. Rampant and people were and before the before the vaccines were available, I think we were extremely careful and all, you know just going out and about, we just were masks and try to, you know, stay out of stay out of crowds and you know, not go into restaurants. Or if we went to a restaurant we set up, we sat outside when that was available. So yeah, I know I don't think anything was really crazy. We just tried to live our lives as best we could. You know, I was worried about it, but I feel like it didn't really constrained my life, more so than I can handle/ So, you know, I certainly concerned but once the vaccine was available, I got vaccinated, it was a lot more— I felt lot more secure than I was because of that. If I got sick, if I got it, I wasn't going to die from it. I think that was the main thing.
KH: And you were just kind of. It seems like you were pretty distraught. And just seeing the amount of people who kind of pushed back about that.
MA: I thought it was crazy. I was more concerned about. That, that again, that it became a political Issue with a political overtones and one group— and one group of people One feels—. From the Trump people, you know— And I really—Thought that was crazy and I couldn't understand why that was happening. That People would say, I'm not going to wear a mask, I'm not going to get vaccinated. You know? I mean, it just seems so—. Because I, you know, when I was a kid, we we I remember that when I was a kid in the summertime, polio was still going around, and it wasn't a vaccine that was, you know, I was like seven, eight, nine, 10 or 11 or whatever. remember how everybody was worried about it and everybody, you know, all the you couldn't go out play with other kids in the Summertime, you know, and there were reports of Polio around and then I remember that we had like a big, every where I lived in North Rosedale with those community center. And the whole the whole subdivision went to the community center. And, you know, big line, everybody in the neighborhood. And we all got a sugar cube with the vaccine and everybody was you know, happy because like, okay, now, you know, this is going to make it go away so I remember living through that and. Thinking, why? Why are we. Not seeing the same response code?
KH: And what do you think's been the big change since the polio vaccine as a child versus getting the vaccine for Covid 19?
MA: I think there's a movement of people who are anti-vax people. And then — and then again, it became like a right wing political issue saying if you're going. To be part of the group, then you're going to say, oh, we're against vaccines. You know, we're going to go, we're going to go along with crazy cures. And you know, just it's just made no sense. I didn't see that that same kind of reaction when polio was, you know. When people were. Getting sick and dying and being paralyzed by Polio people were just scared. Yeah, I think so. Right. Yeah.
KH: Well, thank you so much for your time.
MA: Okay.
Mark Applegate: Yeah. My name is Mark Applegate.
KH: Could you please file your name for the record?
MA: Mark M a r k Applegate. A p p l e g a t e
KH: And, what area do you live in? In the metro Detroit area?
MA: We live in Southfield.
KH: And how long have lived there?
MA: Yeah, about ten years.
KH: And before that, what other areas have you lived in?
MA: Well, I grew up in Detroit. Lived also in Huntington Woods. So I go to the Kalamazoo. Other places too
KH: And, what is your, line of work?
MA: I was, wide area network engineer and I'm retired
KH: And how long did you have that position?
MA: Say about 20 years.
KH: And when did you retire?
MA: 2012.
KH: So, with Covid 19, when were you first aware of the disease?
MA: I think probably pretty soon after it started, I saw news reports about. That A disease that was sweeping through. Europe then, you know, and. So I think, you know Other skiers, at Ski resorts in Austria say for some of the first things I hear about first and then eventually, once it's going into the United States.
KH: And when you first heard about it, were you concerned or would you think like, because I've talked to some people who we live through something like, the Ebola outbreak a couple years ago or swine flu when we were all growing up. And those are things that people were worried about and that ended up not being as serious. Where are you of that mind that it would just be a temporary thing, or were you more worried that it would be more serious?
MA: I was I was concerned about it because, for two reasons. I mean. Essentially I remember yeah, I remember reading about the flu and after World War one, 1918 that, you know, killed. Millions of people across the world. There was potential of something like that occurring. And I also saw I was concerned because well, our government seemed to be totally Incompetent, totally unaware of how to deal with patients individually the President continually lied about about what was going on and what he was doing about it. And essentially, you know, my feeling was. They weren't going to do anything about it.
KH: So you felt like, left by the wayside a little bit.
MA: Well, not left by the wayside. I think I think essentially, I think there were people who were working really hard to save people. To help people to, you know help people that got sick in the United States, you know. People, health care workers were, you know, really killing themselves trying to save everybody they could. the people that were sick in hospitals. And I remember, you know stories about about you know piles of bodies and you know— You know that they will hold in in temporary storage and, you know, it's just and people, you know, health care workers will work and, you know. 70, 80, 90 hours a week. And having them, you know put on all kinds of protective gear. You know, just concerned about what was happening. I think our health system had had some ideas about what to do with it and try and resolve it but it really seemed to the, the leadership of. The government and President Trump was just a disaster. You know, a million people have died. That's, you know. The amount that the people, a million people died who could have lived if we had a reasonable response
KH: And with your experience with Covid, did you contract disease in the past four years?
MA: Yeah, we ended up getting it. I ended up catching, in Germany visiting our and daughter.
KH: And how was your experience with the disease?
MA: Well, I had I think by that point I had, like 4 vaccinations and boosters and It wasn't pleasant. But, you know, I survived it and you know felt bad for a number of days took about two weeks for It to clear out
KH: And then what was your experience with the Covid 19 lockdown?
MA: At that point I was I was retired. So I didn't have to go and I didn't have to go into work and I was, you know working remotely anyway. So, you know.. I think the main, the main problem was the concern about, you know when we had to go out and purchase food you know the main thing was, you know, making sure that we had a mask available to wear. Also, you know, just the whole craziness of people.. of it becoming a political issue, wearing. A mask, becoming a Political issue, and having people you know, harass, you're a threat in here because you had a mask on just seemed ridiculous, you know, to me and say, as it was. It went from being, a health issue to a political issue and a crazy response. Well, you know, to a segment of population.
KH: Did you personally ever get, like, harassed for wearing a mask on public?
MA: Yeah, a number of. Times, yeah. Sort of people made comments or. You know. They acted in a threatening manner or, you know, whatever. Yeah It was it was kind of ridiculous.
KH: And during lockdown, was there anything in particular you tried to do to keep your, your, your mind off what was happening?
MA: See, I don't remember doing anything different. No, I mean, you know, I mean, yeah, we tried. There was a kind of a crazy time, but you just tried to, you know Make sense of things and and, you know, get on with life. So that's all I can remember.
KH: All right. Is there anything on the topic of Covid that we haven't discussed that you'd like to, speak on?
MA: No, I think I think. That's pretty much it. I mean, you know, we've I did, you know, we did travel in Germany while. Well, you know, there were. Covid restrictions, some not so much in lockdown. I thought people there were really pretty sensible. You know, and mass transit trains. And so because of some people, people wore masks and there was a, you know, no bullshit about it. It was just as something you did, everybody did it.
KH: So you so you saw there's like a marked difference of like the response in the Detroit area versus like abroad?
MA: Yeah, for sure. At least in the Detroit area. And, you know, just go. Out, you know, we went hiking sometimes out in Kensington or whatever. And then. You you'd meet people out there who were pointedly not wearing masks and, you know. Or, you know, kind of would make comments about, you know, why are you wearing that here? What's going on? What's wrong with you that kind of stuff
KH: What about, when you would, during the Covid 19, when you would go out into the the city of Detroit was a different than going to someplace like Kensington or did it didn't feel about the same.
MA: Right. No, I never I had a. I think during, you know, during the time that. Covid was was. Rampant and people were and before the before the vaccines were available, I think we were extremely careful and all, you know just going out and about, we just were masks and try to, you know, stay out of stay out of crowds and you know, not go into restaurants. Or if we went to a restaurant we set up, we sat outside when that was available. So yeah, I know I don't think anything was really crazy. We just tried to live our lives as best we could. You know, I was worried about it, but I feel like it didn't really constrained my life, more so than I can handle/ So, you know, I certainly concerned but once the vaccine was available, I got vaccinated, it was a lot more— I felt lot more secure than I was because of that. If I got sick, if I got it, I wasn't going to die from it. I think that was the main thing.
KH: And you were just kind of. It seems like you were pretty distraught. And just seeing the amount of people who kind of pushed back about that.
MA: I thought it was crazy. I was more concerned about. That, that again, that it became a political Issue with a political overtones and one group— and one group of people One feels—. From the Trump people, you know— And I really—Thought that was crazy and I couldn't understand why that was happening. That People would say, I'm not going to wear a mask, I'm not going to get vaccinated. You know? I mean, it just seems so—. Because I, you know, when I was a kid, we we I remember that when I was a kid in the summertime, polio was still going around, and it wasn't a vaccine that was, you know, I was like seven, eight, nine, 10 or 11 or whatever. remember how everybody was worried about it and everybody, you know, all the you couldn't go out play with other kids in the Summertime, you know, and there were reports of Polio around and then I remember that we had like a big, every where I lived in North Rosedale with those community center. And the whole the whole subdivision went to the community center. And, you know, big line, everybody in the neighborhood. And we all got a sugar cube with the vaccine and everybody was you know, happy because like, okay, now, you know, this is going to make it go away so I remember living through that and. Thinking, why? Why are we. Not seeing the same response code?
KH: And what do you think's been the big change since the polio vaccine as a child versus getting the vaccine for Covid 19?
MA: I think there's a movement of people who are anti-vax people. And then — and then again, it became like a right wing political issue saying if you're going. To be part of the group, then you're going to say, oh, we're against vaccines. You know, we're going to go, we're going to go along with crazy cures. And you know, just it's just made no sense. I didn't see that that same kind of reaction when polio was, you know. When people were. Getting sick and dying and being paralyzed by Polio people were just scared. Yeah, I think so. Right. Yeah.
KH: Well, thank you so much for your time.
MA: Okay.
Collection
Citation
“Mark Applegate, September 1st, 2024,” Detroit Historical Society Oral History Archive, accessed February 8, 2025, https://oralhistory.detroithistorical.org/items/show/1062.