Richard Bachmann, September 6th, 2024
Title
Richard Bachmann, September 6th, 2024
Description
In this interview, Richard Bachmann shares his experience as an international student during the prime of Covid-19 and the struggles that came with that.
Publisher
Detroit Historical Society
Rights
Detroit Historical Society
Language
en-US
Narrator/Interviewee's Name
Richard Bachmann
Interviewer's Name
Taylor Claybrook
Date
9/6/2024
Interview Length
41:59
Transcription
Taylor Claybrook: So today is Friday, September 6th, 2024. My name is Taylor Claybrook and I'm sitting down with.
Richard Bachmann: Richard Bachmann.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. Thank you for agreeing to do this interview, Richard.
Richard Bachmann: Absolutely.
Taylor Claybrook: So I want to start by asking, what was your initial reaction to hearing about Covid?
Richard Bachmann: So my initial reaction was, okay, here's here's something that seems to be brewing. I remember we did a field trip with the University of Michigan in March and to D.C. for a project in grad school, and we were flying and some people on that plane were already wearing masks. And I honestly, I thought to myself, okay, you know, this is a little, well, extreme, but I guess, you know, they were talking about how this is becoming a bigger kind of thing and. You know, you're following developments. But I was not that concerned because there were other things before the bird flu and all that. Right. And it just seemed to be something like that. So it came a little bit as a shock, but coming back. And then I think two weeks after we returned from D.C. is when the shutdown happened.
Taylor Claybrook: And what was your reaction to everything being shut down?
Richard Bachmann: I mean, I didn't really. I didn't really know what that meant, to be honest. We were so so do I think the week before everything shut down, we were on a break. We had our spring break and Michigan. And so it was kind of empty already. So and I was I was in Ann Arbor during the break. I was doing stuff. And then people started to return. And then just a few days in, the university stopped all operations were sending people home pretty much. And to me, it seemed to be just a temporary, just precaution, pretty much. But still, you know, so like, I'm obviously not from here originally. I'm an international student on a student visa. So the question also was, what do we do? Right? Do you stay? Do you go back home? I decided to stay because I. I don't know. I initially I wasn't that concerned. I think I'm like, okay, there's these precautions that make sort of sense and let's do what they say we should be doing and probably and it's going to be okay in a few weeks and that's it.
Taylor Claybrook: We're all so hopeful and like, just a couple of weeks. Yeah, normal. Can you explain your program? You have them in your academic career?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, I can. So I in the fall of 2019, I started a Ph.D. program in history. I was in the process of. It's starting to focus more on the history of science technology. And yeah, this was my second semester. So I was taking, you know, classes as the first year of grad schools is taking classes at the time. One of those classes was a museum related class, and I got more interested again in museum studies and thinking about, okay, you know, how can I get more involved in that? But everything seemed to be quite. Normal and even. When we when the campus started to shut down and you know, we. Quickly. I was not teaching at the time, but I was taking some pretty quickly. We were like transitioning to online and the first couple of meetings were kind of awkward because everyone was like, how you guys doing? And you know, what do you say? And also, it was it felt like it's the kind of question that. You don't actually really want to know how people feel. I mean, why do you say it's a pandemic? What if someone just breaks down online and and, you know, how do you deal with that situation? And you could tell that some of the professors, they themselves didn't really know how to handle all that and have other obligations to write. You learned more about their private lives almost because there's kids running around in the background or, you know, you have like an inside in their house because at this point, no one was blurring backgrounds. You had done whatever, right? I mean, we are also so new to this kind of format. And it also felt strange just to engage with each other. And then, you know, the call ends and you were there by yourself. Strange. So I was living in a studio apartment at the time, like a sort of like a smaller space. I didn't. I never felt like. Claustrophobic or locked in. It was actually quite comfortable. How so? And I had my own entrance to the building, too. So I didn't really had to worry about, you know, all of these kind of things. Not that I really did. I remember I was quite disturbed originally when people, you know, you would go outside, you would take a walk and, you know, people started started wearing masks and some people ran glass to being outside and all of that. But then sometimes people would just go down the street and someone would be on the same side, but, you know, a couple of houses down and they would see you coming and just like, stop looking around in panic and just like run across the street and like. This seems to be a little much like I'm not, you know, a leper or anything like that. Like, why am I being perceived like that or treated like you tried to be empathetic, right? But. Still, I felt a little disturbed by that.
Taylor Claybrook: I think that's a good segue into my next question. So you were living in a studio apartment. You were living in Ann Arbor or Detroit.
Richard Bachmann: I was living in Detroit.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. So in Detroit.
Richard Bachmann: Or sorry, I was living in Ann Arbor.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay.
Richard Bachmann: And all of that came.
Taylor Claybrook: So how you kind of talked about how it was going outside, but how did the city change? Because Ann Arbor is usually pretty lively.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah.
Taylor Claybrook: It happened. What was that.
Richard Bachmann: Like? I mean, and initially, again, it was in in in several ways. In hindsight, it feels like. Everything shut down all at once, which was not the case. I mean, first we the campus shut down and the university was sort of signaling to people that it's better for them to go home, but be careful and travel and and all that. Right. But it it quiet down. It felt a little bit. I mean, I didn't know this at the time, but it felt like this summer's feel like in Ann Arbor when the students are gone. Right. It's like a different city. It's much quieter. But initially things were open, right? Still, the you had to wear a mask, You were wearing a mask and people would not go out as much anymore, but you could still do it. And then the next step was for for businesses to shut down, for particularly for like the bars. So the restaurants. Right. And for some time you could still go there. And I felt like when they announced that I there was a there's a bar where I used to go to with my friends. And the day they announced and I think it was a certain time like 4 p.m. or so, you know, these places need to shut down and you didn't really know when they're going to open again or for how long. And so so I, I just went there for lunch, which, you know, I've never done, but I went there for lunch. I sat down and had my little lunch and my beer and there was some people hanging out at the bar and just like regulars there were just talking to the bar keepers and the wait wait staff and no one really knew what to expect. But once these places shut down, I mean, then the city remarkably changed. And I also I remember there's there's just, you know, there's always. The people who are selling that newspaper, the street newspaper who are and then asking for money and and all that. And I thought to myself, wow, this is this must be really hard. I mean, what are they going to do if no one is out and about anymore? And you could tell that, you know, they they tried to. To get some money before, you know, everything kind of went quiet. And not everything, of course, is super like that. Food co-op grocery store was open all all the time. And, but still, I mean that that bars shutting down restaurants, shutting down the barber shop, all these things. Right. That really made a difference.
Taylor Claybrook: So what did keep you busy during lockdown? Like I know you. You were going for walks and you said you were going to that bar before they closed it down. Yeah. What were you doing?
Richard Bachmann: I mean, I was, you know, we were finishing up the semester and we tried to do it as fast as possible. So, you know, it's just sort of are going into the really busy time of the semester with final papers and and all. And that felt kind of strange because it felt like, business as usual in times which I'm not at all business as usual. But I was you know you still you do you do that. It's something to keep you occupied and busy. I was. This just was going to be my first summer after a pretty intense first year. So it's also thinking about that a little bit. Took a lot of walks. I had two friends who were there. We all had our separate apartments, one bedroom, two studio apartments. But we created this little community and basically going on walks that once a day we would get together. We would go on these long walks in different parts of town, exploring it a little bit more. And. Discussing the situation and what to do. Both of them were international students, too. So, you know, we talked about that. Are we going to stay here? We're going to go, how is that going to work and all that? As listening to music and I think, you know, it's just. Yeah. You really using the, Spotify subscription of the university for the first time, exploring stuff and watching, you know, YouTube music videos and that kind of stuff. I was on the phone with my family also to some extent, right? Just checking in and see how things go. And France as well. But yeah, I think that's it. It felt. Pretty normal. It's just I think what was different was just not going to class, just like being in this apartment quite a long time. I also before I lived close to too close to campus, so. I don't know why I did this, honestly, but I never got wi fi in this apartment because it's just like it's kind of cool to just not have it because then if I need it, I need to go out and I need to go to campus. And if I work there, I work down. And if I come home, I sort of like in my. But I needed it then, right? So, you know, I spend some time like reaching out to neighbor and ask if I could, you know, negotiating this awkward situation. And so I know and it didn't end up being a problem, but I know initially I'm like. And I didn't really think about that. And now I'm here without y if I can enter the university buildings anymore. So what do I do about that? But yeah, again, it's. Yeah, it's a real relatively normal. You know, I mean, for grad school, certainly you spend a lot of time by yourself anyways, you know, reading stuff and getting ready for class or working on projects. And that didn't really change for me.
Taylor Claybrook: So I want to go back a little bit. When you said you would check in with your family. Obviously that's very different for you because you are a native of America. Are you? You are from America. So what was it like interacting with them? You know, if they're in Germany and you're here in the climate of, you know, like the pandemic is being handled differently everywhere. So. So what was that like?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, it was a lot of. Contrasting and comparing what their situation was like compared to my situation. My mom and dad were in Germany, most of my family, but my sister and Aspen, they were in Denmark at the time, so we had three different. Experiences in that initial time. And it it seemed I saw him talking about this and I I've been I was watching German news reporting on the situation and I was I'm in the US. I listen to public radio and I get the American view on it too. And I remember that from a German media. They looked at the US and everything seemed to sort of stick and. You know, it's not working. But then whenever I talk to my family and also look at what's going on in Germany and also seem very keen on and I felt like, in a way, I feel like things are handled a little bit better in the US than they are back home. And then really down the line, you know, in terms of like vaccines and and things like that, that that was very much the case. Like I feel like. In the US, people were able to return to some kind of normalcy much faster than they were in Germany and then Denmark. From talking to my sister, checking in with her, I mean, they basically walled themselves off. They closed the borders. So it was also, you know, she's German and is Egyptian. So is like. Okay. And exactly you know a lot of. Like are they allowed to stay there? I think that was not like a question, really. Some concern initially. But I really I had a concern myself, you know, And, I think in July than happened where for a very brief period of time, the Trump administration at the time was discussing whether to basically discontinue student visas to get international students to leave. And then will make it hard for them to come back for the fall semester. And I sort of I, I don't know, I, I never. And I never. Seriously consider it going back to one of the three friends or two friends, the three of us decided after some back and forth that was going on for a couple of weeks, you know, like one week he goes the other week and I'm staying. And but he decided to go back eventually. And then the other friend also was. Plan to go to Germany, actually. She's not German, but was planned to go to Germany. And so there were plans for her to leave at the end of the summer. But for me, I was like, no, I. You know, I, I signed on to this. I, I, I was looking forward to spending five, six years in the US doing this program. I'm not going to go back. I'm not going to do this program. Remote from Germany, sitting at my parents house. Now. I'm not going to do this. This is terrible. So I, I decided rather early on to just sit it out and stick around. I was clear to me that if I leave, then I might have issues coming back in. But if I'm not leaving, they kind of like need to kick me out, you know? I mean, something needs to happen. And they kicked me out. So I'm like, no, I stay put. It's it's going to be okay. My only the only exception I made in my mind was if something were to happen to a family member, then I would obviously go back. But as long as everyone was doing okay and it seemed to be the case, I was fine staying.
Taylor Claybrook: And really quick before I forget. When did you move to Woodbridge?
Richard Bachmann: I moved to Woodbridge in. In January 2022. 2022.
Taylor Claybrook: So by that time, Covid was it was a lot different from it was.
Richard Bachmann: A lot of it was still still happening. So I was teaching.
Taylor Claybrook: But okay, we'll come back to that. So I want to go back to the transition from in-person to online and kind of already discussed that when you were going from online and back to, you know. Back to a classroom and being with your classmates. And then you were teaching wood. What was that like?
Richard Bachmann: I think so. So it was kind of it was a sort of ish a strange situation because. So the fall semester of 2020 with our online, both for my teaching and also for. For my own class. I think the whole academic year actually were online, right? It was the 2020, 20, 21 academic year. I think everything happened just virtual. And then so this was my first first year teaching at the University of Michigan. It's all virtual. All the grad classes were virtual. Then a year later, this is now this the fall semester of 2021. We returned. Yeah. Return to in-person teaching. I think our grad classes were still. We're still online, though. It was this weird mix of virtual and in-person. And I remember that teaching I mean, teaching is so I. Teaching depends so much on on interpersonal interaction. So it's kind of nice to be back in an in-person classroom, but then you're wearing masks and so you actually don't really see people's faces. And then I would do my office hours and they were virtual. And, you know, there you see, you know, both of us were unmasked and this and then you would return the classroom and there's a mask on again. So. There's a little, I don't know, a little odd, I felt. And then just like moving into buildings. And then you go outside and you take off your mask. Some people on campus, it's this weird, like, protocol and and all that, but at least we were all. Vaccinated at this point. There was a vaccination requirement I think the university had put in place. If you wanted to come back to campus, you had to be vaccinated. So I think that really changed things. You know, you're like, okay, I can still get it, but I don't feel like my life is in danger necessarily. I didn't feel like my life is in danger necessarily, and it's different for other people. But so I'm like, okay, that's what we do now.
Taylor Claybrook: So I'm gonna go back to when you moved to Woodbridge. When you. Because I know you're very community oriented. You're very involved. When you talk to your neighbors, do they ever tell you what it was like being in the city, your being in the game during Covid and, you know, kind of where things are today? Because my next part of that question is, how was your sense of community impacted in that can be. Yeah.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. That's interesting because I, I mean I, I signed a lease in. Already for the fall of 2021. But I had committed earlier to house sitting in Ann Arbor. I was sitting at our professors house and there's a dog and more. So I felt like, okay, I can bail on that. So is Subleasing subletting my room here in Woodbridge for the time I had moved some stuff there already. And so it was this weird, like, I'm not here yet, and yet I already am a little bit. And then I moved in in January. 2022 and there's still all this side. Covid. Protection stuff in the House right now is moving in with a roommate. The roommate was working at the public school at the time. So, you know. Out coming back in. And we also spend time together in the house doing all this virtual work. And then it was the winter. So I, I went outside and I explored the neighborhood. But it's, you know, there's not that many people out. And then everything, you know, coffee shop and all this kind of stuff is shut down. Still. It's always back open. But, you know, if I did not have to go, I wouldn't go necessarily, right? I'm like, okay, I'm think I'm good at home. So my community initially was mainly the house and we were pretty close, right? So my roommate and then we have our upstairs unit neighbors there and all of them were friends and the community garden, which was dormant during the winter, but they are all interacting with each other and get to know people. But apart from that, yeah, I was just like so on the neighborhood in the winter and. And from time to time someone would mention how it was, you know, they were there during Covid. During the height of Covid and in the city, and also were discussing vaccination rates. And they're still very low. Right. They never really gone past. The 50% mark is something like that, right? I mean, and I think that's still pretty low at the time. I think it was like 30%.
Taylor Claybrook: You know, when they first started rolling it out, it was no one wanted to get it right.
Richard Bachmann: I mean, there was a lot. Yeah, there was a lot of I mean, I remember we were, you know, there's friends from Ann Arbor that drove to Detroit to get vaccinated because the sports were available in Denver and not being filled. And we had a discussion amongst friends in Ann Arbor whether this is. Ethical to do, you know, like we technically like them. What are we doing? You know, we going to an honorary source city from a city with a lot of resources. To get vaccinated. You know, we should maybe we shouldn't be doing that. We can just wait it out until it's our turn. But yeah, I mean, you still see you. I walk quite a lot. And, you know, I was outside two times, just like walking around Cass corridor or midtown area and even, you know, going downtown and and you just like, see these, you know, just stickers like. Two feet of five feet or whatever. And are these like Covid markings? And you know, that here is like a testing place and also all this trash, like all the mass, you know, just mass trash everywhere. And that really was the. Okay, You know this is happening, but I didn't feel like I know initially. In the pandemic, Detroit was always seen as this thing. At Peace Center and so on kind of thing, right? I mean, it's really bad in Detroit and and strange to them being Ann Arbor and like, wow, I'm not that far away. And I know the city and I've been here before. Right? So I know this city before the pandemic. It's not and I've never really been exposed to Detroit before. Like wow. This is kind of like hard to. To put together in a way. But yeah, I mean it's. But it was not front and center. Was not that something, you know, everyone always talked about Covid and just see how it lives. And I think I'm more so I had the impression that that's something people didn't wanna talk about. You know, it's sort of like, No, no, no, Let's just. It's getting better. Yeah, We still have these spikes and gets a bit scary when Spike happens in the winter, right. In the winter and happened again and when I moved. But it's fine, you know? It's okay.
Taylor Claybrook: Yeah. That's the hard part about doing these interviews is like you get a lot of people who are saying, I don't want to talk about Covid anymore. It's over, right? It's not over, but it's a thing of the past. And lockdown was super hard for a lot of people. But. I did want to ask. So you said you started in fall of 2019 at U of M, and that's when you came to America, was it? Yeah.
Richard Bachmann: Okay. Yeah, obviously. So you. I've been I've been here before a couple of times on shorter periods of time, but I came from high school.
Taylor Claybrook: So you came fall 2019. Everything got shut down in winter 2020 or winter semester 2020. And then when you moved to Detroit, things were still kind of. If you say so. You're still kind of becoming. You know, accustomed to living in this city outside of all these Covid precautions. So what has been your favorite post-COVID activity? You know, something that you couldn't do that you really want to do during Covid and now you can do it again?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. Okay. What's. But it's something where I've really found well, I mean, obviously it was something to to be able to go back and sit in a restaurant and eat in a restaurant. Right. Just like be in a public space. I think. What what, really What really did it for me is like music, like live music, going to a live music show. And and just, you know, feel the music again. I think that voice was something I really, really, really enjoyed when I was able to do it again. And then also when I moved, I learned. That there is a soccer team in Woodbridge. Right. So I joined that soccer team and it was their first. It was outdoors. So it was. And in April, I believe. Just when the season first started, but it was the first. Post-COVID season, I think. Maybe not. But for me, just like, playing like. Playing soccer with other people. That really felt good.
Taylor Claybrook: Is there anything you wish you would have done differently with their Covid precautions, or is there anything that you appreciate about what they did as far as their Covid efforts?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. I mean, initially I think they. There's in the in the summer on the beginning of the fall, semester 2020, we started that semester with the strike. The graduate student union went on strike because we felt and many other employees of the university, as we found out with the strike, felt the same way. The numerous the action had not. Taking all the precautions that they could have taken to create a more safe work environment. And there was this remote work option center. But there's still people who were required to come to campus know because certain things just cannot be done remotely. Like if you work in a laboratory and so on, you can't can do that. So when even some teaching was done remotely and there are students in the dorms and then the the the staff, there was supposed to be sort of like enforcing Covid, the Covid protocol in dorms. And they were vulnerable to all kinds of, you know, harassment and stuff like that. So I felt like and, you know, we. The strike lasted for about two weeks. And then, you know, the university threatened to sue the union or file an injunction and we decided to end the strike and all that. But I feel like that and ten more mobilized people on campus. And then also the university, actually. Address a whole bunch of things that we went on strike for. You know, air filtering systems and also like, here's like three masks and here's this and here is that right? So and I have to say that, you know, you ask me, okay, what they're doing and they need to be pushed, but then they dished out the resources and that was great. So also coming back in initially there was all kinds of issues with like, is there? You know, are there masks in the classrooms or is there, you know, disinfectant that you can use to wipe down surfaces and that kind of stuff? And required some pushing, but then they they also deliver. So I feel like. Okay. That's that's okay. And in terms of in terms of technology to. They they really stepped up rather quickly. And, you know, for online teaching and stuff like that, I think they delivered the tools they were sort of requiring from us to learn rather quickly how to use those tools. I mean, Penn says that you need to. But I know from just friends and other institutions. Had been a very different kind of experience. So yeah.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. In my last question, I've been told it's a bit of a loaded question, but how has Covid impacted who or where you are today? That can be your academic career, professional, personal community.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. I mean, it's. It's kind of strange how, you know, there's this. I know. From some friends who have really been derailed by Covid, who, like lost. A year of research or, you know, personal things happened to them. And and for me, I. I think. It's kind of strange, you know, I haven't thought about Covid. And quite some time to be honest like this, this. But this time is also. Is is buried somewhere in my mind. You know, it's. It feels like. Okay. Then it seemed when it happened, it seemed to be so extraordinary. And now it kind of like just blend in with, you know, the past couple of years. Yeah. Or like seven years ago, I put together my applications for grad school, and then I came to. Yeah, and then Covid happened or yeah, I forgot about that.
Taylor Claybrook: And it's like something I have to reach deep in your body.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, I know. But I wonder if this is. It's just that's how these things go or if it's some form of repression. Yeah, this was pretty traumatic. And, you know, and, let's not touch this or something like that, but I think. I mean, I. In terms of just like public health, I think it created a different kind of awareness. So now I, I, I see the point. For wearing masks when you are sick. Like just if you're out and about. Right. Just also, just be mindful not just of your own health, but also of other people's health. I was just this past weekend, I was at a conference and the conference organizers made the decision because they wanted it to be an inclusive conference. They made the decision of putting a mask requirement in place at the conference. And while this feels odd now because they're like, why am I doing this? I see the point for the greater good. And I'm like, okay, you know, it's it's yeah, it's it's never fun to put these things on. But if it makes the conference more accessible for people who. Who are not two weren't able to get vaccinated and continue to get vaccinated. Where for people who wear Covid, I mean, I've I've had it twice since the last time in June and it's the first time. And it never I was never, like floored or anything. It was always kind of okay is pretty severe. I feel, you know, it's it's like a heavy cold. I definitely feel that. And then more so the the time afterwards where it's just like you're tired, you know, it takes some time to, like, recover from this. But it's it's also at this point that I feel like, okay, I get it. I get it. And it's not a threat. And then but for some people, I mean, it is a serious threat. And people still die from Covid, as you know, they die from the flu or whatever, but there's still people dying from Covid. So it's not like, yeah, whatever, You know, I don't want to. But. Yeah, it's it's. It was an interesting time. I mean, if I'm honest. Sometimes I even be, you know, grad school and I finish these two semesters. And then we had the summer and the summer was like, wide open. Right? And because. The pandemic was happening. I feel like there was not the same kind of like heavy expectation on like you've got to use your summer to do your research and deliver. And there was a little bit more like, okay, you know, we understand if you just want to like be and process. So I even have some moments where I'm like a little like some good times.
Taylor Claybrook: I've been hearing that a lot in interviews, people were like, yeah, I mean, lockdown was scary, but also you could do whatever.
Richard Bachmann: Exactly.
Taylor Claybrook: No one really expected anything of you.
Richard Bachmann: Exactly. And and, and while I've heard this from friends who are in in, like a more. I don't know how, how, how I should put it in, like, a more practical kind of, like, job situation where really they're like, No, no. I mean, we were in grad school still, and so the expectation still was, yeah, you can read. I mean, you can do this even better now because there are no distractions. You can write, you can teach, you can work. And I and some of this was a bit disturbing to me too. It's like, wow, we are pretending this just is the new normal. And, but it also gave some shock. Sure, I understand that too. And then during the summer, this week's was just. Yeah. I mean, nice weather. You get up in the morning, it's kind of slow. You're still taking in the news. And while this is still happening and people are dying and what are the numbers? And I remember initially I was, you know, tracking the numbers, then writing down, okay, this is happening, this new Iraq, and here's this and it is that. But yeah, this does that too. In hindsight, I'm mean.
Taylor Claybrook: I think that's. That's everything. Do you have any other thoughts or questions that you want to share?
Richard Bachmann: No, I mean, the only thing really it would be interesting to to hear, you know, listen to some of the other interviews and see that. You know. This feeling I have of it for other people to have that feeling to of this. Just kind of like slipping. In the background or deep down or whether there's a slide actively is a form of active suppression because it was traumatic and you don't want to touch it or because it actually. Again, I was I was not affected at all by any tragedy in this, that no one in my family died from Covid. No. You know, no friend, no person I know died from it. So I feel like I was spared that shock of loss. And maybe that's why I feel like, yeah, I can just place this. Into the past couple of lives. And and it's hard for me to actually. You know some people in the grad school context like, yeah. You know, I mean we had to go through this and this is why, you know, all funding timelines should be extended. And, and I see, I see that, you know, I personally. Don't don't feel it, though. I don't feel like, wow, I was so heavily affected by this that it kind of like derailed me. And this is why I need longer to do certain things, you know?
Taylor Claybrook: Yeah, it's definitely been a very diverse group of people I've been talking to. Some people were like, Yeah, Covid is a thing that happened and it's sucked. And then I have other people that are like, you know, it didn't affect me that bad. But again, it's one of those things where it's like, Did it not affect me? Or is it like so in the back of my mind now, I don't really want to talk about it because it was going on. So there's just a little bit of everything. But I'm kind of.
Richard Bachmann: Richard Bachmann.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. Thank you for agreeing to do this interview, Richard.
Richard Bachmann: Absolutely.
Taylor Claybrook: So I want to start by asking, what was your initial reaction to hearing about Covid?
Richard Bachmann: So my initial reaction was, okay, here's here's something that seems to be brewing. I remember we did a field trip with the University of Michigan in March and to D.C. for a project in grad school, and we were flying and some people on that plane were already wearing masks. And I honestly, I thought to myself, okay, you know, this is a little, well, extreme, but I guess, you know, they were talking about how this is becoming a bigger kind of thing and. You know, you're following developments. But I was not that concerned because there were other things before the bird flu and all that. Right. And it just seemed to be something like that. So it came a little bit as a shock, but coming back. And then I think two weeks after we returned from D.C. is when the shutdown happened.
Taylor Claybrook: And what was your reaction to everything being shut down?
Richard Bachmann: I mean, I didn't really. I didn't really know what that meant, to be honest. We were so so do I think the week before everything shut down, we were on a break. We had our spring break and Michigan. And so it was kind of empty already. So and I was I was in Ann Arbor during the break. I was doing stuff. And then people started to return. And then just a few days in, the university stopped all operations were sending people home pretty much. And to me, it seemed to be just a temporary, just precaution, pretty much. But still, you know, so like, I'm obviously not from here originally. I'm an international student on a student visa. So the question also was, what do we do? Right? Do you stay? Do you go back home? I decided to stay because I. I don't know. I initially I wasn't that concerned. I think I'm like, okay, there's these precautions that make sort of sense and let's do what they say we should be doing and probably and it's going to be okay in a few weeks and that's it.
Taylor Claybrook: We're all so hopeful and like, just a couple of weeks. Yeah, normal. Can you explain your program? You have them in your academic career?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, I can. So I in the fall of 2019, I started a Ph.D. program in history. I was in the process of. It's starting to focus more on the history of science technology. And yeah, this was my second semester. So I was taking, you know, classes as the first year of grad schools is taking classes at the time. One of those classes was a museum related class, and I got more interested again in museum studies and thinking about, okay, you know, how can I get more involved in that? But everything seemed to be quite. Normal and even. When we when the campus started to shut down and you know, we. Quickly. I was not teaching at the time, but I was taking some pretty quickly. We were like transitioning to online and the first couple of meetings were kind of awkward because everyone was like, how you guys doing? And you know, what do you say? And also, it was it felt like it's the kind of question that. You don't actually really want to know how people feel. I mean, why do you say it's a pandemic? What if someone just breaks down online and and, you know, how do you deal with that situation? And you could tell that some of the professors, they themselves didn't really know how to handle all that and have other obligations to write. You learned more about their private lives almost because there's kids running around in the background or, you know, you have like an inside in their house because at this point, no one was blurring backgrounds. You had done whatever, right? I mean, we are also so new to this kind of format. And it also felt strange just to engage with each other. And then, you know, the call ends and you were there by yourself. Strange. So I was living in a studio apartment at the time, like a sort of like a smaller space. I didn't. I never felt like. Claustrophobic or locked in. It was actually quite comfortable. How so? And I had my own entrance to the building, too. So I didn't really had to worry about, you know, all of these kind of things. Not that I really did. I remember I was quite disturbed originally when people, you know, you would go outside, you would take a walk and, you know, people started started wearing masks and some people ran glass to being outside and all of that. But then sometimes people would just go down the street and someone would be on the same side, but, you know, a couple of houses down and they would see you coming and just like, stop looking around in panic and just like run across the street and like. This seems to be a little much like I'm not, you know, a leper or anything like that. Like, why am I being perceived like that or treated like you tried to be empathetic, right? But. Still, I felt a little disturbed by that.
Taylor Claybrook: I think that's a good segue into my next question. So you were living in a studio apartment. You were living in Ann Arbor or Detroit.
Richard Bachmann: I was living in Detroit.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. So in Detroit.
Richard Bachmann: Or sorry, I was living in Ann Arbor.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay.
Richard Bachmann: And all of that came.
Taylor Claybrook: So how you kind of talked about how it was going outside, but how did the city change? Because Ann Arbor is usually pretty lively.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah.
Taylor Claybrook: It happened. What was that.
Richard Bachmann: Like? I mean, and initially, again, it was in in in several ways. In hindsight, it feels like. Everything shut down all at once, which was not the case. I mean, first we the campus shut down and the university was sort of signaling to people that it's better for them to go home, but be careful and travel and and all that. Right. But it it quiet down. It felt a little bit. I mean, I didn't know this at the time, but it felt like this summer's feel like in Ann Arbor when the students are gone. Right. It's like a different city. It's much quieter. But initially things were open, right? Still, the you had to wear a mask, You were wearing a mask and people would not go out as much anymore, but you could still do it. And then the next step was for for businesses to shut down, for particularly for like the bars. So the restaurants. Right. And for some time you could still go there. And I felt like when they announced that I there was a there's a bar where I used to go to with my friends. And the day they announced and I think it was a certain time like 4 p.m. or so, you know, these places need to shut down and you didn't really know when they're going to open again or for how long. And so so I, I just went there for lunch, which, you know, I've never done, but I went there for lunch. I sat down and had my little lunch and my beer and there was some people hanging out at the bar and just like regulars there were just talking to the bar keepers and the wait wait staff and no one really knew what to expect. But once these places shut down, I mean, then the city remarkably changed. And I also I remember there's there's just, you know, there's always. The people who are selling that newspaper, the street newspaper who are and then asking for money and and all that. And I thought to myself, wow, this is this must be really hard. I mean, what are they going to do if no one is out and about anymore? And you could tell that, you know, they they tried to. To get some money before, you know, everything kind of went quiet. And not everything, of course, is super like that. Food co-op grocery store was open all all the time. And, but still, I mean that that bars shutting down restaurants, shutting down the barber shop, all these things. Right. That really made a difference.
Taylor Claybrook: So what did keep you busy during lockdown? Like I know you. You were going for walks and you said you were going to that bar before they closed it down. Yeah. What were you doing?
Richard Bachmann: I mean, I was, you know, we were finishing up the semester and we tried to do it as fast as possible. So, you know, it's just sort of are going into the really busy time of the semester with final papers and and all. And that felt kind of strange because it felt like, business as usual in times which I'm not at all business as usual. But I was you know you still you do you do that. It's something to keep you occupied and busy. I was. This just was going to be my first summer after a pretty intense first year. So it's also thinking about that a little bit. Took a lot of walks. I had two friends who were there. We all had our separate apartments, one bedroom, two studio apartments. But we created this little community and basically going on walks that once a day we would get together. We would go on these long walks in different parts of town, exploring it a little bit more. And. Discussing the situation and what to do. Both of them were international students, too. So, you know, we talked about that. Are we going to stay here? We're going to go, how is that going to work and all that? As listening to music and I think, you know, it's just. Yeah. You really using the, Spotify subscription of the university for the first time, exploring stuff and watching, you know, YouTube music videos and that kind of stuff. I was on the phone with my family also to some extent, right? Just checking in and see how things go. And France as well. But yeah, I think that's it. It felt. Pretty normal. It's just I think what was different was just not going to class, just like being in this apartment quite a long time. I also before I lived close to too close to campus, so. I don't know why I did this, honestly, but I never got wi fi in this apartment because it's just like it's kind of cool to just not have it because then if I need it, I need to go out and I need to go to campus. And if I work there, I work down. And if I come home, I sort of like in my. But I needed it then, right? So, you know, I spend some time like reaching out to neighbor and ask if I could, you know, negotiating this awkward situation. And so I know and it didn't end up being a problem, but I know initially I'm like. And I didn't really think about that. And now I'm here without y if I can enter the university buildings anymore. So what do I do about that? But yeah, again, it's. Yeah, it's a real relatively normal. You know, I mean, for grad school, certainly you spend a lot of time by yourself anyways, you know, reading stuff and getting ready for class or working on projects. And that didn't really change for me.
Taylor Claybrook: So I want to go back a little bit. When you said you would check in with your family. Obviously that's very different for you because you are a native of America. Are you? You are from America. So what was it like interacting with them? You know, if they're in Germany and you're here in the climate of, you know, like the pandemic is being handled differently everywhere. So. So what was that like?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, it was a lot of. Contrasting and comparing what their situation was like compared to my situation. My mom and dad were in Germany, most of my family, but my sister and Aspen, they were in Denmark at the time, so we had three different. Experiences in that initial time. And it it seemed I saw him talking about this and I I've been I was watching German news reporting on the situation and I was I'm in the US. I listen to public radio and I get the American view on it too. And I remember that from a German media. They looked at the US and everything seemed to sort of stick and. You know, it's not working. But then whenever I talk to my family and also look at what's going on in Germany and also seem very keen on and I felt like, in a way, I feel like things are handled a little bit better in the US than they are back home. And then really down the line, you know, in terms of like vaccines and and things like that, that that was very much the case. Like I feel like. In the US, people were able to return to some kind of normalcy much faster than they were in Germany and then Denmark. From talking to my sister, checking in with her, I mean, they basically walled themselves off. They closed the borders. So it was also, you know, she's German and is Egyptian. So is like. Okay. And exactly you know a lot of. Like are they allowed to stay there? I think that was not like a question, really. Some concern initially. But I really I had a concern myself, you know, And, I think in July than happened where for a very brief period of time, the Trump administration at the time was discussing whether to basically discontinue student visas to get international students to leave. And then will make it hard for them to come back for the fall semester. And I sort of I, I don't know, I, I never. And I never. Seriously consider it going back to one of the three friends or two friends, the three of us decided after some back and forth that was going on for a couple of weeks, you know, like one week he goes the other week and I'm staying. And but he decided to go back eventually. And then the other friend also was. Plan to go to Germany, actually. She's not German, but was planned to go to Germany. And so there were plans for her to leave at the end of the summer. But for me, I was like, no, I. You know, I, I signed on to this. I, I, I was looking forward to spending five, six years in the US doing this program. I'm not going to go back. I'm not going to do this program. Remote from Germany, sitting at my parents house. Now. I'm not going to do this. This is terrible. So I, I decided rather early on to just sit it out and stick around. I was clear to me that if I leave, then I might have issues coming back in. But if I'm not leaving, they kind of like need to kick me out, you know? I mean, something needs to happen. And they kicked me out. So I'm like, no, I stay put. It's it's going to be okay. My only the only exception I made in my mind was if something were to happen to a family member, then I would obviously go back. But as long as everyone was doing okay and it seemed to be the case, I was fine staying.
Taylor Claybrook: And really quick before I forget. When did you move to Woodbridge?
Richard Bachmann: I moved to Woodbridge in. In January 2022. 2022.
Taylor Claybrook: So by that time, Covid was it was a lot different from it was.
Richard Bachmann: A lot of it was still still happening. So I was teaching.
Taylor Claybrook: But okay, we'll come back to that. So I want to go back to the transition from in-person to online and kind of already discussed that when you were going from online and back to, you know. Back to a classroom and being with your classmates. And then you were teaching wood. What was that like?
Richard Bachmann: I think so. So it was kind of it was a sort of ish a strange situation because. So the fall semester of 2020 with our online, both for my teaching and also for. For my own class. I think the whole academic year actually were online, right? It was the 2020, 20, 21 academic year. I think everything happened just virtual. And then so this was my first first year teaching at the University of Michigan. It's all virtual. All the grad classes were virtual. Then a year later, this is now this the fall semester of 2021. We returned. Yeah. Return to in-person teaching. I think our grad classes were still. We're still online, though. It was this weird mix of virtual and in-person. And I remember that teaching I mean, teaching is so I. Teaching depends so much on on interpersonal interaction. So it's kind of nice to be back in an in-person classroom, but then you're wearing masks and so you actually don't really see people's faces. And then I would do my office hours and they were virtual. And, you know, there you see, you know, both of us were unmasked and this and then you would return the classroom and there's a mask on again. So. There's a little, I don't know, a little odd, I felt. And then just like moving into buildings. And then you go outside and you take off your mask. Some people on campus, it's this weird, like, protocol and and all that, but at least we were all. Vaccinated at this point. There was a vaccination requirement I think the university had put in place. If you wanted to come back to campus, you had to be vaccinated. So I think that really changed things. You know, you're like, okay, I can still get it, but I don't feel like my life is in danger necessarily. I didn't feel like my life is in danger necessarily, and it's different for other people. But so I'm like, okay, that's what we do now.
Taylor Claybrook: So I'm gonna go back to when you moved to Woodbridge. When you. Because I know you're very community oriented. You're very involved. When you talk to your neighbors, do they ever tell you what it was like being in the city, your being in the game during Covid and, you know, kind of where things are today? Because my next part of that question is, how was your sense of community impacted in that can be. Yeah.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. That's interesting because I, I mean I, I signed a lease in. Already for the fall of 2021. But I had committed earlier to house sitting in Ann Arbor. I was sitting at our professors house and there's a dog and more. So I felt like, okay, I can bail on that. So is Subleasing subletting my room here in Woodbridge for the time I had moved some stuff there already. And so it was this weird, like, I'm not here yet, and yet I already am a little bit. And then I moved in in January. 2022 and there's still all this side. Covid. Protection stuff in the House right now is moving in with a roommate. The roommate was working at the public school at the time. So, you know. Out coming back in. And we also spend time together in the house doing all this virtual work. And then it was the winter. So I, I went outside and I explored the neighborhood. But it's, you know, there's not that many people out. And then everything, you know, coffee shop and all this kind of stuff is shut down. Still. It's always back open. But, you know, if I did not have to go, I wouldn't go necessarily, right? I'm like, okay, I'm think I'm good at home. So my community initially was mainly the house and we were pretty close, right? So my roommate and then we have our upstairs unit neighbors there and all of them were friends and the community garden, which was dormant during the winter, but they are all interacting with each other and get to know people. But apart from that, yeah, I was just like so on the neighborhood in the winter and. And from time to time someone would mention how it was, you know, they were there during Covid. During the height of Covid and in the city, and also were discussing vaccination rates. And they're still very low. Right. They never really gone past. The 50% mark is something like that, right? I mean, and I think that's still pretty low at the time. I think it was like 30%.
Taylor Claybrook: You know, when they first started rolling it out, it was no one wanted to get it right.
Richard Bachmann: I mean, there was a lot. Yeah, there was a lot of I mean, I remember we were, you know, there's friends from Ann Arbor that drove to Detroit to get vaccinated because the sports were available in Denver and not being filled. And we had a discussion amongst friends in Ann Arbor whether this is. Ethical to do, you know, like we technically like them. What are we doing? You know, we going to an honorary source city from a city with a lot of resources. To get vaccinated. You know, we should maybe we shouldn't be doing that. We can just wait it out until it's our turn. But yeah, I mean, you still see you. I walk quite a lot. And, you know, I was outside two times, just like walking around Cass corridor or midtown area and even, you know, going downtown and and you just like, see these, you know, just stickers like. Two feet of five feet or whatever. And are these like Covid markings? And you know, that here is like a testing place and also all this trash, like all the mass, you know, just mass trash everywhere. And that really was the. Okay, You know this is happening, but I didn't feel like I know initially. In the pandemic, Detroit was always seen as this thing. At Peace Center and so on kind of thing, right? I mean, it's really bad in Detroit and and strange to them being Ann Arbor and like, wow, I'm not that far away. And I know the city and I've been here before. Right? So I know this city before the pandemic. It's not and I've never really been exposed to Detroit before. Like wow. This is kind of like hard to. To put together in a way. But yeah, I mean it's. But it was not front and center. Was not that something, you know, everyone always talked about Covid and just see how it lives. And I think I'm more so I had the impression that that's something people didn't wanna talk about. You know, it's sort of like, No, no, no, Let's just. It's getting better. Yeah, We still have these spikes and gets a bit scary when Spike happens in the winter, right. In the winter and happened again and when I moved. But it's fine, you know? It's okay.
Taylor Claybrook: Yeah. That's the hard part about doing these interviews is like you get a lot of people who are saying, I don't want to talk about Covid anymore. It's over, right? It's not over, but it's a thing of the past. And lockdown was super hard for a lot of people. But. I did want to ask. So you said you started in fall of 2019 at U of M, and that's when you came to America, was it? Yeah.
Richard Bachmann: Okay. Yeah, obviously. So you. I've been I've been here before a couple of times on shorter periods of time, but I came from high school.
Taylor Claybrook: So you came fall 2019. Everything got shut down in winter 2020 or winter semester 2020. And then when you moved to Detroit, things were still kind of. If you say so. You're still kind of becoming. You know, accustomed to living in this city outside of all these Covid precautions. So what has been your favorite post-COVID activity? You know, something that you couldn't do that you really want to do during Covid and now you can do it again?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. Okay. What's. But it's something where I've really found well, I mean, obviously it was something to to be able to go back and sit in a restaurant and eat in a restaurant. Right. Just like be in a public space. I think. What what, really What really did it for me is like music, like live music, going to a live music show. And and just, you know, feel the music again. I think that voice was something I really, really, really enjoyed when I was able to do it again. And then also when I moved, I learned. That there is a soccer team in Woodbridge. Right. So I joined that soccer team and it was their first. It was outdoors. So it was. And in April, I believe. Just when the season first started, but it was the first. Post-COVID season, I think. Maybe not. But for me, just like, playing like. Playing soccer with other people. That really felt good.
Taylor Claybrook: Is there anything you wish you would have done differently with their Covid precautions, or is there anything that you appreciate about what they did as far as their Covid efforts?
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. I mean, initially I think they. There's in the in the summer on the beginning of the fall, semester 2020, we started that semester with the strike. The graduate student union went on strike because we felt and many other employees of the university, as we found out with the strike, felt the same way. The numerous the action had not. Taking all the precautions that they could have taken to create a more safe work environment. And there was this remote work option center. But there's still people who were required to come to campus know because certain things just cannot be done remotely. Like if you work in a laboratory and so on, you can't can do that. So when even some teaching was done remotely and there are students in the dorms and then the the the staff, there was supposed to be sort of like enforcing Covid, the Covid protocol in dorms. And they were vulnerable to all kinds of, you know, harassment and stuff like that. So I felt like and, you know, we. The strike lasted for about two weeks. And then, you know, the university threatened to sue the union or file an injunction and we decided to end the strike and all that. But I feel like that and ten more mobilized people on campus. And then also the university, actually. Address a whole bunch of things that we went on strike for. You know, air filtering systems and also like, here's like three masks and here's this and here is that right? So and I have to say that, you know, you ask me, okay, what they're doing and they need to be pushed, but then they dished out the resources and that was great. So also coming back in initially there was all kinds of issues with like, is there? You know, are there masks in the classrooms or is there, you know, disinfectant that you can use to wipe down surfaces and that kind of stuff? And required some pushing, but then they they also deliver. So I feel like. Okay. That's that's okay. And in terms of in terms of technology to. They they really stepped up rather quickly. And, you know, for online teaching and stuff like that, I think they delivered the tools they were sort of requiring from us to learn rather quickly how to use those tools. I mean, Penn says that you need to. But I know from just friends and other institutions. Had been a very different kind of experience. So yeah.
Taylor Claybrook: Okay. In my last question, I've been told it's a bit of a loaded question, but how has Covid impacted who or where you are today? That can be your academic career, professional, personal community.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah. I mean, it's. It's kind of strange how, you know, there's this. I know. From some friends who have really been derailed by Covid, who, like lost. A year of research or, you know, personal things happened to them. And and for me, I. I think. It's kind of strange, you know, I haven't thought about Covid. And quite some time to be honest like this, this. But this time is also. Is is buried somewhere in my mind. You know, it's. It feels like. Okay. Then it seemed when it happened, it seemed to be so extraordinary. And now it kind of like just blend in with, you know, the past couple of years. Yeah. Or like seven years ago, I put together my applications for grad school, and then I came to. Yeah, and then Covid happened or yeah, I forgot about that.
Taylor Claybrook: And it's like something I have to reach deep in your body.
Richard Bachmann: Yeah, I know. But I wonder if this is. It's just that's how these things go or if it's some form of repression. Yeah, this was pretty traumatic. And, you know, and, let's not touch this or something like that, but I think. I mean, I. In terms of just like public health, I think it created a different kind of awareness. So now I, I, I see the point. For wearing masks when you are sick. Like just if you're out and about. Right. Just also, just be mindful not just of your own health, but also of other people's health. I was just this past weekend, I was at a conference and the conference organizers made the decision because they wanted it to be an inclusive conference. They made the decision of putting a mask requirement in place at the conference. And while this feels odd now because they're like, why am I doing this? I see the point for the greater good. And I'm like, okay, you know, it's it's yeah, it's it's never fun to put these things on. But if it makes the conference more accessible for people who. Who are not two weren't able to get vaccinated and continue to get vaccinated. Where for people who wear Covid, I mean, I've I've had it twice since the last time in June and it's the first time. And it never I was never, like floored or anything. It was always kind of okay is pretty severe. I feel, you know, it's it's like a heavy cold. I definitely feel that. And then more so the the time afterwards where it's just like you're tired, you know, it takes some time to, like, recover from this. But it's it's also at this point that I feel like, okay, I get it. I get it. And it's not a threat. And then but for some people, I mean, it is a serious threat. And people still die from Covid, as you know, they die from the flu or whatever, but there's still people dying from Covid. So it's not like, yeah, whatever, You know, I don't want to. But. Yeah, it's it's. It was an interesting time. I mean, if I'm honest. Sometimes I even be, you know, grad school and I finish these two semesters. And then we had the summer and the summer was like, wide open. Right? And because. The pandemic was happening. I feel like there was not the same kind of like heavy expectation on like you've got to use your summer to do your research and deliver. And there was a little bit more like, okay, you know, we understand if you just want to like be and process. So I even have some moments where I'm like a little like some good times.
Taylor Claybrook: I've been hearing that a lot in interviews, people were like, yeah, I mean, lockdown was scary, but also you could do whatever.
Richard Bachmann: Exactly.
Taylor Claybrook: No one really expected anything of you.
Richard Bachmann: Exactly. And and, and while I've heard this from friends who are in in, like a more. I don't know how, how, how I should put it in, like, a more practical kind of, like, job situation where really they're like, No, no. I mean, we were in grad school still, and so the expectation still was, yeah, you can read. I mean, you can do this even better now because there are no distractions. You can write, you can teach, you can work. And I and some of this was a bit disturbing to me too. It's like, wow, we are pretending this just is the new normal. And, but it also gave some shock. Sure, I understand that too. And then during the summer, this week's was just. Yeah. I mean, nice weather. You get up in the morning, it's kind of slow. You're still taking in the news. And while this is still happening and people are dying and what are the numbers? And I remember initially I was, you know, tracking the numbers, then writing down, okay, this is happening, this new Iraq, and here's this and it is that. But yeah, this does that too. In hindsight, I'm mean.
Taylor Claybrook: I think that's. That's everything. Do you have any other thoughts or questions that you want to share?
Richard Bachmann: No, I mean, the only thing really it would be interesting to to hear, you know, listen to some of the other interviews and see that. You know. This feeling I have of it for other people to have that feeling to of this. Just kind of like slipping. In the background or deep down or whether there's a slide actively is a form of active suppression because it was traumatic and you don't want to touch it or because it actually. Again, I was I was not affected at all by any tragedy in this, that no one in my family died from Covid. No. You know, no friend, no person I know died from it. So I feel like I was spared that shock of loss. And maybe that's why I feel like, yeah, I can just place this. Into the past couple of lives. And and it's hard for me to actually. You know some people in the grad school context like, yeah. You know, I mean we had to go through this and this is why, you know, all funding timelines should be extended. And, and I see, I see that, you know, I personally. Don't don't feel it, though. I don't feel like, wow, I was so heavily affected by this that it kind of like derailed me. And this is why I need longer to do certain things, you know?
Taylor Claybrook: Yeah, it's definitely been a very diverse group of people I've been talking to. Some people were like, Yeah, Covid is a thing that happened and it's sucked. And then I have other people that are like, you know, it didn't affect me that bad. But again, it's one of those things where it's like, Did it not affect me? Or is it like so in the back of my mind now, I don't really want to talk about it because it was going on. So there's just a little bit of everything. But I'm kind of.
Collection
Citation
“Richard Bachmann, September 6th, 2024,” Detroit Historical Society Oral History Archive, accessed November 6, 2024, https://oralhistory.detroithistorical.org/items/show/1074.